Wonderland Burlesque's "Do I Still Like That?" Quiz, Part 1

Wonderland Burlesque's 

Do I Still Like That? Quiz, Part 1

Bit of a rogues gallery, today.

Celebrities do awful things. They are human beings, after all, and even though we put them on a pedestal, pay them way too much money, buy their artistic offerings, hold them in high esteem and to higher standards, sometimes... they fuck up. 

Or they turn out not to be the person we thought they are at all. 

Or they are dealing with substance abuse.

Or they are dealing with some kind of crazy in their heads.

Or they are merely ignorant, racist, homophobic, privileged assholes.

No matter. In the end, they disappoint (at best) or (at worst) anger us - and down from their lofty perch they tumble. 

Sort of. 

For some? Well, they're an industry. Other people's paychecks depend on these people getting out there and doing shows, writing songs, recording or writing new material, putting out another movie. Yes - for some  - The Show Biz community has their backs, no matter what. 

Sure, there is always that moment or two where everybody looks at their feet, shaking their heads with dismay, and not coming to the fallen one's defense. But a few news cycles go by and... the redemption period begins. Some make it. Others? Well, what they've done is so egregious, they simply can't come back from it. There are also those whose careers are simply not substantially established enough to withstand even a whiff of scandal. 

These next couple weeks (Maybe three? Because I keep coming up with names,) we'll be looking at celebrity Humpty Dumpty's who've experienced a big fall, or have royally pissed us off. 

The big question being? Sure, we despise what they did but does that mean we can't continue to enjoy watching or listening to __________? 

I almost called this the Can I Still Like That? Quiz, but we're all adults and we can do as we please. But... where do YOU draw the line?

The quiz is easy. I mention a celeb, list their sins, and you tell me whether or not you can enjoy any of their past or current work... KNOWING WHAT THEY DID! 

Can they be redeemed? 

You, tell me.

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1/ Woody Allen 

The Beef:

Allen has been suspected of having sexual relations with minors since 1992, when Allen was found with nude photos of his partner Mia Farrow's 20-year-old adopted daughter, Soon-Yi. Allen and Soon-Yi were married in 1997. In 2014, Allen's adopted daughter, Dylan Farrow, accused Allen of sexual assault. The accusations were examined in depth in the 2021 documentary Allen v. Farrow.

I wrestle with this one. See, Allen is the reason this quiz is happening. I was at The Dollar Store, going through their DVDs, when I came upon a copy of Radio Days, starring Mia Farrow and Julie Kavner. I adore both actresses and remember the film fondly, but I struggled with myself. Can I... should I... is it okay... to buy, watch and enjoy a Woody Allen film? 

The Boyfriend has pretty hard set rules about such things. If they were a dick, we can't watch them anymore. Period. 

Well, I bought the DVD, even though, once I got to the counter, I felt a bit like I used to when purchasing gay porn at the local dirty bookstore. 

About those accusations... I don't know. Nothing was every conclusively proven. It came down to she said, he said, the brother made a documentary and wrote stories for haughty magazines, Mia said... and I believe Mia. And I believe accusers. 

I stopped going to movie theatres to see Woody Allen films. 

Does that mean that I can't enjoy Another Woman, or The Purple Rose of Cairo, or Broadway Danny Rose, or (gasp) Interiors?

Well. I don't. I haven't seen a Woody Allen film since the scandal broke. I own a bunch of his films, but I can't bring myself to watch them. 

I have a hard time making peace with the idea that a much older man, out of the blue, one day, looks at his step-daughter and starts thinking... oh, a second chance at love? 

The creep factor. It decides this for me every time. (Even though I bought that DVD.)

(I did it to prevent someone else from enjoying it!)

Can they be redeemed? 

No. 

For future generations? Maybe. We all forgave (forgot about) Charlie Chaplin. 

2/ Ellen DeGeneres

The Beef:
When asked about anonymous tabloid reports that she is not always nice to her workers, she thought the accusations were false, “The one thing I want is for everyone to be happy and proud of where they work, and if not, don’t work here.” In July 2020, BuzzFeed News ran articles in which anonymous former employees accused the show of being a toxic workplace, accused the executive producers of harassment, as well as alleging an atmosphere with racist comments and microaggressions. Warner Media began an investigation. DeGeneres apologized to her staff, writing that she intended for her show to be a place where "no one would ever raise their voice, and everyone would be treated with respect" and that she was "disappointed to learn that this has not been the case." Following the investigation, three executives left, and the show vowed to take steps to change the culture; DeGeneres apologized again during the eighteenth season's September 2020 opening.

I've also read that she's mean.

I think I've witnessed her whole career; from the time she won that contest to the present. I want to trust her, but something about her doesn't feel genuine. 

She's always struck me as a bit of a phony. 

So, when I hear bad things about her, or bad things going on around her, I want to believe it because it supports that narrative. 

I don't know that you can be super nice and be super successful. Dolly Parton springs to mind, but she's from a whole different age of show biz.

As for Ellen, I don't like her. I used to. I don't know what became of her. She's morphed herself  so much in order to wear so many different clown suits that I don't think there is a genuine human being in there. 

I know she's a gay icon. I know she once did a very brave thing. 

But that doesn't erase how very false her existence feels to me.

So, I'm out. 

Can they be redeemed?

She was never really tarnished. By any of it. 

3/ CeeLo Green 

The Beef:

On June 16, 2011, journalist Andrea Swensson of City Pages negatively reviewed one of Green's performances, writing that it "failed to measure up to the fun factor of his recorded material. Green spent most of the set stationed in front of a microphone at the center of the stage, barely moving an inch while he sang, and flanked by two forgettable back-up singers and a DJ that was all but hidden behind a giant LCD display". In response, the following day Green tweeted "I respect your criticism but be fair! People enjoyed last night! I'm guessing ur gay? And my masculinity offended u? well fuck U!" Green promptly received angered responses from some of his followers on Twitter, to which he replied "Apologies gay community! what was homophobic about that?" In a subsequent interview with magazine Us Weekly, Green stated that his comments were meant in good fun, adding that "I am not harboring any sort of negative feeling toward the gay community" and that "I am one of the most liberal artists that I think you will ever meet, and I pride myself on that."

In 2012, CeeLo Green was accused of sexually assaulting a woman whom he had eaten dinner with in Los Angeles. The LA District Attorney did not have enough evidence to bring rape charges, and Green was later charged with furnishing a controlled substance. He pled no contest to the drug charge. On August 31, 2014, Green was criticized for tweets relating to his sexual battery court case. Two of his specific tweets regarding rape were "People who have really been raped REMEMBER!!!" and "If someone is passed out they're not even WITH you consciously! so WITH Implies consent." After sending a number of tweets on the topic of rape, he temporarily deactivated his Twitter account. He re-activated it a number of hours later, tweeting the following apology: "I truly and deeply apologize for the comments attributed to me on Twitter. Those comments were idiotic, untrue and not what I believe."

CeeLo Green is an incredibly talented man. 

It's a pity we will never learn just HOW talented he is. 

I adored his stuff. He was hitting all my sweet spots. Crazy? Fuck You? Classics. 

However, it doesn't make up for being a terrible human being. When your go-to play is 'you must be gay' (like that's an insult?) then you are wired all wrong, my dear. And I can't even begin to address how distressing his comments about rape remain. That kind of ignorance resonates in the straight male global psyche. It's utter poison and those that spout it? Utter garbage.

Can they be redeemed.

No. 

He wasn't established enough to overcome this. His days as a performer are through.

4/ J.K. Rowling 

The Beef:

The power of Twitter. On Saturday, June 6, author J.K. Rowling came under fire after posting multiple tweets that seemingly slammed the trans community. The controversy began when the Harry Potter creator, 54, shared an article titled “Opinion: Creating a more equal post-COVID-19 world for people who menstruate.” In addition to linking to the post, she tweeted, “‘People who menstruate.’ I’m sure there used to be a word for those people. Someone help me out. Wumben? Wimpund? Woomud?”

When receiving angry responses that explained that transgender, non-binary and gender-nonconforming people can menstruate, the author claimed that she has done her research. “I’ve spent much of the last three years reading books, blogs and scientific papers by trans people, medics and gender specialists. I know exactly what the distinction is,” the producer tweeted. “Never assume that because someone thinks differently, they have no knowledge.”

If sex isn’t real, there’s no same-sex attraction. If sex isn’t real, the lived reality of women globally is erased. I know and love trans people, but erasing the concept of sex removes the ability of many to meaningfully discuss their lives. It isn’t hate to speak the truth,” the author wrote. “The idea that women like me, who’ve been empathetic to trans people for decades, feeling kinship because they’re vulnerable in the same way as women – ie, to male violence – ‘hate’ trans people because they think sex is real and has lived consequences – is a nonsense. I respect every trans person’s right to live any way that feels authentic and comfortable to them. I’d march with you if you were discriminated against on the basis of being trans. At the same time, my life has been shaped by being female. I do not believe it’s hateful to say so.”

For the record, Rowling has been, in the past, very pro-gay and considered an ally. Where this comes from? Who knows. The workings of the mind? It seems a strange hill to want to die on. And by that, I mean, her whole argument - it's a rather odd distinction to make, to feel that it's important to draw that line and call it out. I mean... wot's it to you? 

But she's done exactly that and has not budged, will not see the error in her thinking. 

Hers is such a specific kind of ignorance, I don't know if I'm upset about it or concerned for her mental health. Is this what vast fame/success breeds?

Now, it matters not to me. I've always found her writing rather substandard and the whole Potter universe whimsical and fanciful, but not for me. As for the films, I sat through one and felt like I was watching a Hallmark movie - it was pleasant, but rather boring. So, I'm not missing out on anything, here. But I do feel for those who are devotees. 

Can they be redeemed?

Of course. Admitting that she's wrong would be a brilliant first step. Second step would be to write something worth reading. But now she's tarnished forever, and I don't think she's the sort to back down or change her opinion.

5/ R. Kelly  

The Beef:

Kelly was charged with statutory rape and child pornography in 2002 after a video surfaced that appeared to show Kelly having sex and urinating on an underage girl. After several delays, Kelly was found not guilty in 2008.

In 2019, Kelly was charged with 10 counts of "aggravated criminal sexual [misconduct]" involving girls between the ages of 13 and 16. Cook County State’s Attorney Kim Foxx urged victims to come forward after a 2018 documentary, Surviving R. Kelly. At least two women reportedly responded.

In September 2021, R. Kelly was found guilty of racketeering, including acts of bribery and sexual exploitation of a child, along with separate sex trafficking charges.

These allegations are so salacious. I can't believe he survived the 2008 scandal. Of course, I believe the victims. From what they say, he's one messed up MOFO. 

Thing is...  he's incredibly talented. I love his voice. He was the new Marvin Gaye, bigger than life. Personally, I never want to hear I Believe I Can Fly ever again in my lifetime, because so many people have sung it, but the rest of his catalog is a lot of fun. 

Still... I can't bring myself to enjoy it. 

It's the creep factor.

Can they be redeemed?

No. There's no coming back from this. I know he still has a fan base and they don't (want to) believe the charges and won't except the outcome, but his career is so over.

6/ Mel Gibson

The Beef:

On July 28, 2006, Gibson was arrested by Sheriff's Deputy James Mee of the Los Angeles County Sheriff's Department for driving under the influence (DUI) while speeding in his vehicle with an open container of alcohol. According to a 2011 article in Vanity Fair, Gibson first told the arresting officer, "My life is over. I'm fucked. Robyn's going to leave me." According to the arrest report, Gibson exploded into an angry tirade when the arresting officer would not allow him to drive home. Gibson said to the officer, "Fucking Jews... the Jews are responsible for all the wars in the world. Are you a Jew?"

After the arrest report was leaked on TMZ.com, Gibson issued two apologies through his publicist, and - in a televised interview with Diane Sawyer -he affirmed the accuracy of the quotations. He further apologized for his "despicable" behavior, saying that the comments were "blurted out in a moment of insanity", and asked to meet with Jewish leaders to help him "discern the appropriate path for healing." After Gibson's arrest, his publicist said he had entered a recovery program to battle alcoholism.

In July 2010, Gibson had been recorded during a phone call with Oksana Grigorieva suggesting that if she got "raped by a pack of niggers", she would be to blame. Gibson was barred from coming near Grigorieva or their daughter due to a domestic violence-related restraining order. The Los Angeles County Sheriff's Department launched a domestic violence investigation against Gibson, later dropped when Gibson pleaded no contest to a misdemeanor battery charge. 

I decided not to list his blatant homophobia that came to light in the late 1990's. He apologized... not that I believed him for a second.

He's absolutely a despicable human being and a bit of a nut job. Totally toxic. Passion of Christ? Jesus Christ! And people simply ate up his little sado-masochistic act; the thing raked in 370 million! I have never seen it and never will, but everything I have read about it makes me think the man is certifiably insane. 

And yet people like Jodi Foster and Robert Downey, Jr. seem to have no problem with him. The Academy actually nominated him for best director in 2016! 

Can they be redeemed? 

According to Hollywood, he has been. In my eyes?

No f'ing way, bud.

The man's a total dick.

7/ Taylor Dayne 

The Beef: 

Diva raised eyebrows and quite a bit of ire for performing/attending a 2021 mask-less New Year's party hosted by The Orange Ogre and Cokehead, Jr. at Mar-a-Lago, after which Dayne declared, "I try to stay non-political."

On her twitter feed she stated, “I’m saddened by all this. I have a 30 yr careers s that many diverse friendships .and I try to stay non political and non judgmental and not preach . I sing from my heart purely and from Source. I wish for all to be who they need to be .. and find their way.”

First off, in comparison to some of the other transgressions listed, this is a rather minor offense, but an offense nonetheless. 

And this isn't Dayne's first misstep. When asked about gay marriage, before it was legal, she  offered up some BS about the Kabbalah saying only male and female energy can create a true marriage (?), but then stated in 2014 that she considers the LGBT community to be her most loyal fanbase.

And it's true. We gays embraced her big time. Her first hit was the first song I ever danced to at a gay bar, so she's occupied a special place in my heart and CD collection. 

I still adore her music. Without it, I would have never made it through a year in GD MF Iowa. 

But now...? 

I want to give her a pass, though others are not so inclined. Amber, another of my favorite divas, came for Dayne big time on Twitter. And the outrage from her (former) fans was quite vocal. 

How do I ignore that? 

Can they be redeemed?

Yes. But she has to make amends big time, like do Pride Festivals for cost. I dunno. But I am open to welcoming her back into the fold, just not sure what she can do in order to accomplish that. I still enjoy her music.

8/ Michael Jackson 

The Beef:

In 1993, Michael Jackson was accused of child molestation. The 1994 civil trial ended with a settlement between Jackson and the alleged victim. In 2003, Jackson was charged with seven counts of child sexual abuse and was found not guilty in 2005.

He may be dead, but he's legendary... and not just for his music. His was such an odd life. It's as if he morphed into some alien form. And then... there is the creep factor - never conclusively proven, but... c'mon. If not guilty, he sure put a target on his back, repeatedly. 

Every time I hear one of his songs on the radio I cringe. It also brings to mind the family, who, because they must protect his legacy in their own self-interest, refuse to consider the possibility that Jackson's victims are telling the truth. That is the power of greed. That is the power of denial. 

Can they be redeemed?

No. There's more to this story... and it is just a matter of time.

All the amazing music he created during his lifetime does not make up for all the cray-cray. What he did to his face? That's self abuse on a very public stage. 

For me? He will always remain a creep. Incredibly talented... but a creep.

Sorry, Janet.

9/ Kirstie Alley

The Beef:

Her political affiliation: she's a MAGA. She's also a diehard Scientologist. And she says absolutely horrendous things on Twitter.

I don't know what demons haunt the head of Alley, but I don't want to ever meet them. She is one scary broad. Raging, hateful, and on the wrong side of everything, this raven-haired beauty went from from ravishing to savaging during the course of a career pockmarked with questionable choices, manic episodes, over-indulgence and immaturity. It's like the dame never grew the F up. 

While she plays lip service to 'owning' her sh*t, her words ring hollow, as she continues to embarrass herself on a national stage with the brazen disregard for humanity that only the truly delusional and ignorant can manifest. 

Can they be redeemed?

I don't think there is enough psychological acumen to shrink this vitamin C crazy train. She's thoroughly on a track for a complete public meltdown. I don't even think Scientology can save her her voluptuously appointed behind. 

Thing is... I adored her. I loved her squeaky, Lucille Ball-inspired comedic style. She has always been sexy, even in Fat Actress. 

But I don't see her coming to her senses anytime soon. If that should come to pass? I would forgive her. Mental illness is not something a person can be held responsible for, if they are seeking appropriate treatment, disciplined about following through, and truly 'own' their past behavior.

Alley hasn't shown any intention of doing any of that. 

That she's still breathing? Pretty remarkable. 

10/ Peter Townshend

The Beef: 

Townshend accepted a caution from the Metropolitan Police (the Met) as part of Operation Ore, a major investigation on child pornography conducted in 2002–2003. The Met stated that "it was established that Mr Townshend was not in possession of any downloaded child abuse images". Townshend was placed on the sex offenders register for five years in 2003 after admitting he had used his credit card to access a child pornography website. Townshend initially claimed that he accessed the images as research in a campaign against child sexual abuse; in 2012, he wrote in his autobiography, Who I Am, that he had accessed the illegal images to prove that British banks were complicit in channeling the profits from pedophile rings. An article by investigative reporter Duncan Campbell that was published in PC Pro magazine revealed that police had no evidence that the website accessed by Townshend involved children and nothing incriminating was found on his personal computer.

Meh. All this proves is... money can get you out of anything. 

Townshend (The Who), may be a rock icon, but I think he's a terribly flawed person. He's never been honest about his sexuality, playing the dodge game all along... and, in a way, who can blame him? All he has to risk is alienating diehard Who fans and losing revenue. 

That said, I think he might be a bit more relevant today if he had come clean about himself. The charges in 2003 raised all sorts of red flags for me, and I have a hard time enjoying his music these days.

Can they be redeemed?

Yes, but he's got to be honest about himself and come clean. In this day and age? What has he got to lose that he hasn't already lost? I think he would gain a lot more simply being honest with the world. 

--- ---

And that's it for me. Your turn.  Can they be redeemed? Do you still enjoy their work? 

Leave your thoughts in the comments section. I love hearing from you.

And don't worry... you favorite 'bad' celeb not on this list? We have another two weeks to go. 

Tune in next week for another terrible ten!

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